Unbalance

[Freon22]

Page you can not talk balance when you make trading ships weaker and hunting ship stronger. Saying that a hunter can move into a stronger hunter with slower turns rate doesn't mean anything on a fast running game with small galaxies. Before the hunter were made to do more damage there was still interaction, all this mean is there will be more pods. Which before you would have the same interaction but the hunter would not always get the kill. Not saying the hunter will get everyone now but will more then likely have a much better chance since he will be hitting with more weapons.

[Kard]

Kard's super long post

FU is hunter class also, just so we are consistent here. Also we are talking about the most expensive 2 ships in the entire game, not just hunting. Sure DC might be too fast, but I dont think it needs all these nerfings especially with other ships having just a shade lower defenses (cara/rav and ITAC is higher defense). I do agree it don't need holds and probably could have them removed. I am fine with it being with 100 mines as there are other ships with more mines than it. I don't know why activity of a player is being brought into this as no one is to know if that will be consistent for one, and we should be promoting active play anyways. As for the fed report part that you mention Kard that's just smart hunting, any alliance could do that, just like any alliance could pool its money and get someone in a DC. TBH I'm a bit surprised you are criticizing smart team play.

I wasnt critisizing. I was trying to better explain why fatman is frustrated. Just like many others are. Personaly, i coudlnt care, I'll adapt. I was trying to show some of you who cant sympithise with fatman, why this perfect storm of circumstances is creating some players who just face roll alot of people. A really awesome ship, with small maps and super high game speeds.

Also, in this game, money isnt really an object. I dont think money should be the balancing factor for ships. I mean, alliances later in the game, can go through 5,6,7 FUs in a week, before they go bankrupt. And an alliance can pool together and get someone a DC, then that dc, from kills, funds the next DC. Money should never be the balancing factor. Otherwise, we should impliment the Spooky Midnight Special, and make it 1tril. I mean even if an alliance saved up and gave sergei one, its alright because it cost them 4 weeks of money. Well guess what, sergei would never be podded again, and would kill planets and ports by himself, and take on fleets of 10 warbirds lol.

I dont give two squats if Orca and Sergei create programs that track when people are online, and ring alarms when 1 exp or turn is used, or puts together their pings and draws a ling on the gal map in the sectors someone traveled through, or that fires twice per second for them. I'll adapt. I just like opping. Hopefully i get some of that in soon. I need my fix!

EDIT*
LOL btw IM not accusing them of using programs like that. NOT AT ALL. I dont think they have any of those things i said. I was trying to state that no matter what other people do in game, it wont drive me away. Just wanted to clarify that.

[Freon22]

Fatman you should edit your post. You should not let things get you you so much. I have been fighting to get balance for years it has not got me anywhere but I keep trying. Your post is crossing a bad line.

Edit: Guess I was a little slow on this post. lol

[Fatman]

I have been fighting that fight for a long time too Freon....just had my fill of it....8) them...

*Edited by RCK. Discussions about admin actions are to be addressed through the proper channels (myself or another admin). NOT on the forum.*

[Freon22]

Its all cool a good night sleep and things will look better tomorrow. Like they say tomorrow is aways a better day. Take care all I am off to sleep. good night!

[Page]

Page you can not talk balance when you make trading ships weaker and hunting ship stronger.

Trade ships were unbalanced, there was no trade off between them at all, they were also too strong, sure /15 made sense back when we had a mix of people with very fast and very slow connections, but nowadays that's not really the case so much. So the people who are quick/careful can have the ability to make that pay off for them in a freighter or similar, whereas the ones who can't can go for the PT/PF instead.

Saying that a hunter can move into a stronger hunter with slower turns rate doesn't mean anything on a fast running game with small galaxies.

Again that depends on whether the hunter is actually efficient with their turns at all, but I would agree the game speed makes for very fast ships regardless of base speed, so it really does weaken the benefit of the faster ships and make it harder to use as a balancing tool. At the same time the changes made to make this a trade off were done to ships which were previously never used.

Before the hunter were made to do more damage there was still interaction, all this mean is there will be more pods.

I haven't actually bumped up the actual offense of hunters from where they ever were (the low level ones were just bumped up to be similar to the ones that actually got used sometimes).

Also, in this game, money isnt really an object. I dont think money should be the balancing factor for ships. I mean, alliances later in the game, can go through 5,6,7 FUs in a week, before they go bankrupt.

You are right that money isn't really the limiting factor, at the same time you'd only spend the extra money on good players, there are many players you would not pay for a DC/FU for, since they would just burn straight through all your money. Still since a better ship essentially acts as a force multiplier it makes a good player even better, and so limiting it to only the already good players makes it seem even stronger than it already is, since you don't get to see all the newbs failing with the same stuff ;)
For now though, that is indeed the main balancing point of those two ships and for those who haven't noticed I tend to try to address one subset of ships each round (it is easier to balance them with each other and use iteration to see the effects of each change and build upon), so just be patient.

they dont care about anyone but themselves and their friends freon....thats why all the game changes have ben slanted towards hunting...always have been and probably alway s will be

Yes, so why don't you try to become my friend? :P
Seriously though, I have never spoken to Orca or Sergei, except I think once back in the day to mock Orca's failed attempts to kill me (I just switched routes and he came for me about 3 different ones that trade session). In short I honestly do not know them at all, so couldn't exactly call them friends either :P Also I personally have pretty much always traded, never really been a hunter (sure, I did it a few times in the past and was ok, but it was pretty rare). So to make accusations that I'm friends with all these hunters and that I myself am also one is just completely unbased, in fact when I used to play a lot what I primarily did (besides trading) was to run newbie alliances to try and teach people the game.

[Blade]

I dont think the ship is the problem.

The combat is..
I would go in to a large post detailing why I thought that but I dont have the time or the arm to do it.

Basically nerf weapons maybe 3-6% accuracy. Dont take away the amount of damage they do but the accuracy needs to be toned down. People with crappy exp are still hitting almost like the magic level 30 (Of my day) but still a good 10-15 levels away from it. That tells me that combat accuracy is at least 5-7% inaccurate.

A 30k DC should not be able to take a 40k trader (/10 or /12) in 2-3 shots! Unless it was lucky, but you can't be lucky every time you pull the trigger, problem here is to many people are super lucky meaning combat needs looking at!

This is coming from somone who did nothing but hunt years back. I struggle to play because something is not right and I get bored after 5 minutes. Honestly on part nothing against the coders or admins you know I love you guys

[JettJackson]

I dont think the ship is the problem.

The combat is..
I would go in to a large post detailing why I thought that but I dont have the time or the arm to do it.

Basically nerf weapons maybe 3-6% accuracy. Dont take away the amount of damage they do but the accuracy needs to be toned down. People with crappy exp are still hitting almost like the magic level 30 (Of my day) but still a good 10-15 levels away from it. That tells me that combat accuracy is at least 5-7% inaccurate.

A 30k DC should not be able to take a 40k trader (/10 or /12) in 2-3 shots! Unless it was lucky, but you can't be lucky every time you pull the trigger, problem here is to many people are super lucky meaning combat needs looking at!

This is coming from somone who did nothing but hunt years back. I struggle to play because something is not right and I get bored after 5 minutes. Honestly on part nothing against the coders or admins you know I love you guys

Just to reference your post, most of Sergei's kills that are 2-3 shots were on ships that were /6. The kills of /10 or better have been 4-6 shots, the kill on jobu at /16 was 6 shots but he also had a 15k advantage. Not sure where the 2-3 shots on /10 or > is coming from though. It's unfortunate you don't have the desire like before though

[Infinity]

Check his logs again...
I have 4 shots for a /12, 3 shots fot a /13 (similar lvl player as well), 4 shots on /11 (higher lvl player at the time), 4 shots on a /10

Like he has added accuracy just for him.

Edit: "I have" as in "I have his logs..."

[RCK]

Like he has added accuracy just for him.

Its right below the "RCK will always loose in a battle" line.