Raiding Rewards

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XDemonX
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Raiding Rewards

Post by XDemonX »

I want this to be more of a discussion than a suggestion since this has been suggested before. I know Bouncer and I have personally talked about this. I am hoping to get more people involved in this.

The way the game is moving is the end usually consists of opping. There are two types of raiding ops: port raiding and planet busting. Planet busting usually nets a loss for an alliance who ops. When I lead my stat padding fun alliances, we don't typically planet bust because it usually costs a lot of turns, exp, money and time and it nets little to no kills.

An example is last night. We took a ton of pods for a couple kills. Lost a lot of money and lost even more experience. We still have 4 more planets to take and it just doesn't feel rewarding at all to planet bust. Rosie and I were messing around attempting to trash talk each other (I don't think we can take each other seriously) and he used a line that I normally use that makes sense... "You took 9 pods to get 3 kills..." and he is right.. it honestly doesn't make sense unless you are lucky enough to bust the lander. I know the game is about taking all the planets to win the draft round but why the massive losses in money and experience? Poor Jester lost over 50k experience from 2 pods to the planet.

I would like us to come together and discuss what could make planet busting be more rewarding. So please post some possible discussions points and lets go from there. All of these would be SLIGHT coding changes that Page, Spock or Astax could quickly perform (even I could assist if needed).

1) Increase experience gained greatly. Damage done to planet should be a formula that involves planet level*# of people in sector firing*damage = experience gained. Reason I want number of people in combat to effect it is I don't want to promote boosting by someone just stocking shields on a planet and another person going by theirselves and taking turns boosting exp. I would like to see people gain 5k+ from planet busting. Port raiding now gives a lot of money, inversely shouldn't planet busting give experience?

2) Reduce experience loss from deaths. Again, Jester losing 50k to two pods to the planet is dumb and it is an absolute buzz kill. It doesn't make sense why exp loss is so high to planet deaths.

3) REMOVE DEATHS FROM COUNTING. Dying during a planet bust is already enough of a setback. You have to buy a new ship and rearm so you lose a lot of turns. You can't really control the deaths unless you go ikky/nij every game. It also discourages player from planet busting because they don't want the deaths stacking up.

Anymore points to discuss? Please don't be a lurker. Take the 2 min to reply even if its "I agree" or "I disagree"
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Incognito
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Re: Raiding Rewards

Post by Incognito »

I'd like to see deaths to ports and planets count separately. Let all deaths count for the alliance, but for individuals it could be separate.
I believe the percent exp loss on death to a planet right now is 27-planet lvl/10. So a spooky pod to a level 45 rock costs 112.5k. If this could be adjusted based on player level as well as planet level, that could balance it.

As for planet damage experience, 20 damage = 1 exp right now. This could go as high as 5 damage/exp. in addition, destroying a gen, hanger, or turret could result in an exp gain for everyone in the shot, similar to the gain from building the structure. That way, bigger fleets attacking larger planets can make more experience than one or two people attacking a small rock.
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XDemonX
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Re: Raiding Rewards

Post by XDemonX »

Incognito wrote:I'd like to see deaths to ports and planets count separately. Let all deaths count for the alliance, but for individuals it could be separate.
I believe the percent exp loss on death to a planet right now is 27-planet lvl/10. So a spooky pod to a level 45 rock costs 112.5k. If this could be adjusted based on player level as well as planet level, that could balance it.

As for planet damage experience, 20 damage = 1 exp right now. This could go as high as 5 damage/exp. in addition, destroying a gen, hanger, or turret could result in an exp gain for everyone in the shot, similar to the gain from building the structure. That way, bigger fleets attacking larger planets can make more experience than one or two people attacking a small rock.
Sounds good to me. Tell Page/Astax/Spock to make the hotfix.
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JettJackson
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Re: Raiding Rewards

Post by JettJackson »

Incognito wrote:I'd like to see deaths to ports and planets count separately. Let all deaths count for the alliance, but for individuals it could be separate.
I believe the percent exp loss on death to a planet right now is 27-planet lvl/10. So a spooky pod to a level 45 rock costs 112.5k. If this could be adjusted based on player level as well as planet level, that could balance it.

As for planet damage experience, 20 damage = 1 exp right now. This could go as high as 5 damage/exp. in addition, destroying a gen, hanger, or turret could result in an exp gain for everyone in the shot, similar to the gain from building the structure. That way, bigger fleets attacking larger planets can make more experience than one or two people attacking a small rock.
I would be for raising the planet and port damage experience as well. It is way too low compared to the death costs. I would not change the death costs though because there is already a benefit of having such a minimal loss in a player vs player combat death loss.
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XDemonX
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Re: Raiding Rewards

Post by XDemonX »

JettJackson wrote:
Incognito wrote:I'd like to see deaths to ports and planets count separately. Let all deaths count for the alliance, but for individuals it could be separate.
I believe the percent exp loss on death to a planet right now is 27-planet lvl/10. So a spooky pod to a level 45 rock costs 112.5k. If this could be adjusted based on player level as well as planet level, that could balance it.

As for planet damage experience, 20 damage = 1 exp right now. This could go as high as 5 damage/exp. in addition, destroying a gen, hanger, or turret could result in an exp gain for everyone in the shot, similar to the gain from building the structure. That way, bigger fleets attacking larger planets can make more experience than one or two people attacking a small rock.
I would be for raising the planet and port damage experience as well. It is way too low compared to the death costs. I would not change the death costs though because there is already a benefit of having such a minimal loss in a player vs player combat death loss.
It doesn't make sense that Player vs. Player death cost is LESS than Planet vs. Player. Bouncer and I discussed this a while back and we both agree that it should be lowered. When I lead ops, if I have enough people opping I will try to make the super high experience players sit out because I don't want them losing 50k+ to a pod. If it's similar to dying to a player or even lower then it is worth risking them. A huge exp loss like that should only be in stuff like dying to forces. As in Bouncer's example.. a 500k player dying is over 1/5th of their experience.. that is insane.

Also to further drive this point, we want more players to op and want to op. opping should be FUN.. There are plenty of players who love trading high experience and work towards that all game, then they op and lose weeks worth of trading due to a pod from planet? that is not fun.. Those players simply have a poor op attendance because really, I don't blame them... opping against (most of the time) empty planets losing tons of experience doesn't seem worth it at times.
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JettJackson
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Re: Raiding Rewards

Post by JettJackson »

XDemonX wrote:
JettJackson wrote:
Incognito wrote:I'd like to see deaths to ports and planets count separately. Let all deaths count for the alliance, but for individuals it could be separate.
I believe the percent exp loss on death to a planet right now is 27-planet lvl/10. So a spooky pod to a level 45 rock costs 112.5k. If this could be adjusted based on player level as well as planet level, that could balance it.

As for planet damage experience, 20 damage = 1 exp right now. This could go as high as 5 damage/exp. in addition, destroying a gen, hanger, or turret could result in an exp gain for everyone in the shot, similar to the gain from building the structure. That way, bigger fleets attacking larger planets can make more experience than one or two people attacking a small rock.
I would be for raising the planet and port damage experience as well. It is way too low compared to the death costs. I would not change the death costs though because there is already a benefit of having such a minimal loss in a player vs player combat death loss.
It doesn't make sense that Player vs. Player death cost is LESS than Planet vs. Player. Bouncer and I discussed this a while back and we both agree that it should be lowered. When I lead ops, if I have enough people opping I will try to make the super high experience players sit out because I don't want them losing 50k+ to a pod. If it's similar to dying to a player or even lower then it is worth risking them. A huge exp loss like that should only be in stuff like dying to forces. As in Bouncer's example.. a 500k player dying is over 1/5th of their experience.. that is insane.

Also to further drive this point, we want more players to op and want to op. opping should be FUN.. There are plenty of players who love trading high experience and work towards that all game, then they op and lose weeks worth of trading due to a pod from planet? that is not fun.. Those players simply have a poor op attendance because really, I don't blame them... opping against (most of the time) empty planets losing tons of experience doesn't seem worth it at times.
PvP deaths should cost more than they do, but I don't want to get into a situation where planet or port deaths don't cost much. Look at the costs of pods to planets or ports back in the day, you still had high exp people opping then. If we lower the cost of death to a planet or port it has to come at a cost elsewhere else you start weakening the planet and strengthening high exp people who already don't need a boost. Note: I am not against changing the experience loss but it has to come with balancing.
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XDemonX
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Re: Raiding Rewards

Post by XDemonX »

PvP deaths should cost more than they do, but I don't want to get into a situation where planet or port deaths don't cost much. Look at the costs of pods to planets or ports back in the day, you still had high exp people opping then. If we lower the cost of death to a planet or port it has to come at a cost elsewhere else you start weakening the planet and strengthening high exp people who already don't need a boost. Note: I am not against changing the experience loss but it has to come with balancing.
JJ, your logic makes zero sense and you are not grasping the point. Opping planets SUCKS for high exp people and it makes it not fun. Reduce the amount of exp lost and planet busting deaths are not so devastating. PvP deaths are fine as they are. Start increasing the exp lost from that and get less people wanting to fight. We want to encourage fighting.

During that 1 op last night, we lost 96,836 experience due to planet deaths and that is WITH 3 of the deaths being to extremely low exp people (399 loss, 180 loss and 1927 loss). Seems a bit drastic. There is no reason an alliance should be hurt so badly because of planet deaths. Actually high exp people need more of a boost. Stop citing that "well in the past we haven't had a problem" that is your go to answer for every discussion about a chance.. wake the eff up the game needs to get better.. change needs to happen and this is low hanging fruit.
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JettJackson
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Re: Raiding Rewards

Post by JettJackson »

XDemonX wrote:
PvP deaths should cost more than they do, but I don't want to get into a situation where planet or port deaths don't cost much. Look at the costs of pods to planets or ports back in the day, you still had high exp people opping then. If we lower the cost of death to a planet or port it has to come at a cost elsewhere else you start weakening the planet and strengthening high exp people who already don't need a boost. Note: I am not against changing the experience loss but it has to come with balancing.
JJ, your logic makes zero sense and you are not grasping the point. Opping planets SUCKS for high exp people and it makes it not fun. Reduce the amount of exp lost and planet busting deaths are not so devastating. PvP deaths are fine as they are. Start increasing the exp lost from that and get less people wanting to fight. We want to encourage fighting.

During that 1 op last night, we lost 96,836 experience due to planet deaths and that is WITH 3 of the deaths being to extremely low exp people (399 loss, 180 loss and 1927 loss). Seems a bit drastic. There is no reason an alliance should be hurt so badly because of planet deaths. Actually high exp people need more of a boost. Stop citing that "well in the past we haven't had a problem" that is your go to answer for every discussion about a chance.. wake the eff up the game needs to get better.. change needs to happen and this is low hanging fruit.
I'm not saying exp loss to planets is fine but to me you are making it sound like you want minimal losses for high exp players. Those players already get enough benefits from being high experience. There are countless things that are experience based and if you want to make experience losses less than there has to be a balance somewhere. Otherwise you have high experience players getting all the advantage with none of the risk.
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XDemonX
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Re: Raiding Rewards

Post by XDemonX »

JettJackson wrote:
XDemonX wrote:
PvP deaths should cost more than they do, but I don't want to get into a situation where planet or port deaths don't cost much. Look at the costs of pods to planets or ports back in the day, you still had high exp people opping then. If we lower the cost of death to a planet or port it has to come at a cost elsewhere else you start weakening the planet and strengthening high exp people who already don't need a boost. Note: I am not against changing the experience loss but it has to come with balancing.
JJ, your logic makes zero sense and you are not grasping the point. Opping planets SUCKS for high exp people and it makes it not fun. Reduce the amount of exp lost and planet busting deaths are not so devastating. PvP deaths are fine as they are. Start increasing the exp lost from that and get less people wanting to fight. We want to encourage fighting.

During that 1 op last night, we lost 96,836 experience due to planet deaths and that is WITH 3 of the deaths being to extremely low exp people (399 loss, 180 loss and 1927 loss). Seems a bit drastic. There is no reason an alliance should be hurt so badly because of planet deaths. Actually high exp people need more of a boost. Stop citing that "well in the past we haven't had a problem" that is your go to answer for every discussion about a chance.. wake the eff up the game needs to get better.. change needs to happen and this is low hanging fruit.
I'm not saying exp loss to planets is fine but to me you are making it sound like you want minimal losses for high exp players. Those players already get enough benefits from being high experience. There are countless things that are experience based and if you want to make experience losses less than there has to be a balance somewhere. Otherwise you have high experience players getting all the advantage with none of the risk.
Your brain can't figure this out. For the 1000th time.. stop posting on my topics. I have you blocked in game for a reason. I have already been told by countless people that you have went to certain alliance members of mine trying to ask them to make me quit the game. You clearly have a negative bias towards me so you will always disagree with my topics and spam my posts. So do NOT post on my topics. Just because you have an admin tag doesn't mean you don't have to follow the rules. One day you will learn that.
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JettJackson
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Re: Raiding Rewards

Post by JettJackson »

Excuse me but topics involving changes in game aren't specifically exclusive to you. I think you need to be careful with your wording here because there is no reason why I or anyone else can post in a thread discussing changes in game.
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