Ships

[JettJackson]

eliminate the Fed Pro. and leave LS raider

[Infinity]

Why? It's damn useful... I'd rather just change it to Utility class, as then there's no acc loss. Also, leave LS as raider and take off some defenses from LT and keep it as hunter, and also change FU to hunter, as we talked in #smr-beta recently.

[JettJackson]

i think just removing the f-p and the l-t would make more rational sense as it would be the less of things to remove/change

[Blade]

i think just removing the f-p and the l-t would make more rational sense as it would be the less of things to remove/change

Agreed

[Edgecrusher]

No, not agreed. Blade, your point was that in choosing between evil and good you make a choice as to what goods you can trade, but ALSO what role you take in the game: hunting when you're evil and raiding when you're good. Maintaining a raiding class ship for evil people is :D: if they want to raid, then go good. With donating goods changing your alignment has become (too) easy, so changing alignment isn't a big deal.

Kiky, you want to have a ship that combines the cloak to raiding capability. Well, fine, then go wq human, cause they should have the only ship that is able to do that. I haven't heard any argument for keeping the top evil ships, other than that you like using them. And that's not very convincing.

I agree with removing the FP, but then I would suggest also introducing a gadget for good people, for example one that would further improve the mine clearing capabilities of fed ships.

[Infinity]

Kiky, you want to have a ship that combines the cloak to raiding capability.

Not particularly, tho I've been contemplating on going WQH next round

What I said 2-3 nights ago is that LS is useless as a raider, cause why would you bring such an expensive ship to a huge planet bust? Waste of alliance funds imo. Even if I would as a Nijarin have default 300 and all remaining 400 (total of 700) in planetary drone resistance I'd still have to die at some point to a big planet, cause without DCS this is still only 24.5% reduce of dmg done by CDs.

Only reason why I said LS should be a raider class ship (even though I'd never go raid anything that can pod me in it) is that with it's combined class it was overpowered. LS is a) huge, b) overly functional, add some xp to the mix and hey... I'm deadly, am I? That ship is meant for high xp and skillful pilots (I'm not trying to give my self compliments, lol) and the accuracy advantage gained from it's hunter class shouldn't exist. Therefor LS together with FA should be a rarely used ship. Currently, there's only 3 LS (well two, our Spooky died) in the game.

For a planet bust... I stick to my lovely Rage, thank you.

Still, I wouldn't take out neither of 2nd tier ships, tho I see that we're hardly going to make a consensus on this issue, together with reclassing some of the racial ships into hunters.

[Edgecrusher]

I don't get this. You admit that those ships are rarely used, yet you don't want to remove them?

Then why have evil or good alignment at all? Get me right, I am highly in favor of a more diverse game, including choices like going evil or good, going trader, excavater or hunter, and others, so I am all in favor of drastically altering fed ships and evil ships.

I think you're a bit negative saying that we can't get to any consensus, we've seen some nice ideas in this thread and I don't mind discussing them some more.

[Infinity]

You admit that those ships are rarely used, yet you don't want to remove them?

That ship is meant for high xp and skillful pilots ... Therefor LS together with FA should be rarely used ships.

(grammar of my quotes corrected)

Ok, I was talking about FA and LS, and no one mentioned removing those ships, all I saw on this thread is removing LT and FP. We've had several discussions on how FAs (well, LS would come in here as well) are not meant for everyone and how there's too many pilots flying them, as they're pricey, real pricey, so when I said there were 3 LS' this round total then I think we' re on the right track with the purpose of these ships and pilots that fly them. If and when player base increases, people learn the game etc. there might be a few more, but there shouldn't be 50 of them ever as the situation with FAs has been so far. So, you've picked up wrongly what I meant.

DC is far too small to take down, even with mines, top racial raider. Maybe I lack skill, maybe DC lacks firepower. It's great in first half of the round, but later on it can be exchanged for a LT, therefor I wouldn't like that ship removed but slightly lower it's defenses in order to maintain it's hunter purpose. Not because I will fly it, I change the way I play almost every round depending on alliance I'm with and plans of that alliance, but because I expect to see more red players on CPL in the future. You are all green this round, even you EC, you haven't flied an evil ship in a while, actually, not since SMR 1.5 started.

LS being a godlike ship as it is, should be raider class for the reasons I've stated in my previous post but it still remains the most functional galaxy defender out there. Just as DC was in SMR1 the most functional ship.

Back to FP.. EE used it, I've had 3-4 people all the time in them, they wouldn't be getting FAs cause of it's price and cause at that time there was absolutely no need for FAs, and I see this ship as a utility ship, mostly mine-clearer (yes, you can do this in a FW too, but if an alliance comes to a situation that their enemy has a vast minefield and completely unapproachable planet galaxy, those 3-4 FPs with all armor guns accompanied with few birds for protection can sweep the mines into ashes pretty effectively). I don't know how do you guys build your fleet but I take time to think thru my members xp, skill, alignment etc. Therefor FP has it's use in my book and if I was green you'd see me in FP, hardly in FA.

One other reason for keeping both FP and LT in game is the need of switching ships at times. Some of my alliance mates were switching from top racial to FP and back, I did the same with LT as I'm not taking a /28 ship to hit a planet, or a lvl9 port for that matter.

I try not to be negative, it just seems so at the moment. As long as discussion is constructive we will get to a solution, and we are being rather constructive so far.

My full suggestion is somewhere in this thread::

Why? It's damn useful... I'd rather just change it to Utility class, as then there's no acc loss. Also, leave LS as raider and take off some defenses from LT and keep it as hunter, and also change FU to hunter, as we talked in #smr-beta recently.

This way, greenies get a good hunter and a utility class ship and they keep their fancy raider. Evils get a multi-finctional ship (LS) that isn't overpowered by additional accuracy gain, and they keep their hunting role having 2 hunter class ships, one slightly better than the other.

[Baalzamon]

Suggestion from the sideline:

Why not just do what was mentioned a while back in suggestions forum and add another class...Warbird. This class would be a step up from hunter and a step down from Raider. Acc affect wouldn't exist, just like a utility ship. Sounds to me like the LS would be a good candidate for a Warbird (as well as the traditional WBs of old).

I have yet to go evil in 1.5, and I've never flown an FP, and the 2 FAs I had were blown up within 30min...so I really have nothing else to say on the subject

[Infinity]

Well, coding wise, it's the same as utility ship which is already in the code, so for simplicity of implementation we could stick to what's already there. But you can always call it differently in the ship list. Good point for LS.