Combat Idea

[Kard]

I dont remember SM being 1v1. If it was, then my memory fails me, but just because it was in SM, doesnt mean it is better. Lots of improvements have happened since SM.

EDIT*
question. How did they raid ports and planets if all combat in SM was 1v1? Were planets different? I know at one point you could put HHGs and Nukes on planets, but I mean at the height of SM, before it went under, ports and planets were 1v1 combat? Offline fleets were 1v1 Combat?

[JettJackson]

I dont remember SM being 1v1. If it was, then my memory fails me, but just because it was in SM, doesnt mean it is better. Lots of improvements have happened since SM.

EDIT*
question. How did they raid ports and planets if all combat in SM was 1v1? Were planets different? I know at one point you could put HHGs and Nukes on planets, but I mean at the height of SM, before it went under, ports and planets were 1v1 combat? Offline fleets were 1v1 Combat?

Old SM i don't believe was 1v1. The washed up new version was.

[JettJackson]

As for this idea, I have many issues with it, some of which kard brought up. Furthermore it weakens landing fleet which would promote landing spread out. This in turn makes busting landers much less profitable. The problem is there is no in between, its either land all together and advantage to the lander busters as they'd kill the offliners first or spread out and advantage landers. Plus another issue is this basically takes any of the luck factor out of the game. Personally I like some luck involved, I mean if everything was straight forward people would just trade to 500k and destroy everyone after. The other issue is that slow or new players who may not fire as fast as elite vets would miss out on kills that would normally come in fleet fighting. The other day we had a newb get 3 kills in an ATM, you telling me with this change he would be able to do that? I would tell you that you are wrong. The fact is there are too many issues that are rising that would lead me to believe this is a bad idea.

[JettJackson]

1v1 combat only, just wouldnt work. It takes all the safetey out of parking anywhere but fed.

One idea ive tossed around in my head for years, but would be a massive change to the game:

Make each ship have its own delays. Trade ships would have the slowest delays. moving, trading, unoing, would take a PT for argument sake, 750ms, an ACV 700ms, and PSF has 800ms delays. Hunting ships would be the fastest, with a Jugernaught having 300ms delays, ITAC would have 325ms delays, and carapace would have 250ms delays. Top racials and anything big, would have medium delays. EOS would have 500ms delay, MS would have 575ms delays, TAC would have 475ms delays.

This would definatly bring dynamic to fleeting and combat. The decisions you make would have to be very calculated, and factor in your ship, the enemy ship, not just defence and weapon setup and exp, but now factor in will he get that 5th trigger before me, or do i need to uno now then re attack knowing that if he attacks twice while i uno, i can then fire twice before he clicks CS>delay>Examine UNO>delay>buy shields.

If these are too fast, we could try out slow games, which would be far more newbie friendly, where delays are 2x normal. So you would have time to get shot, see the damage you did and he did, and make a calculated decision because you had 1500ms before his delay and your delay was up.

Im not in anyway proposing this idea. It was just something ive been kicking around in my head for like a decade, and thought it might bring something to the discussion, because making everything 1v1 combat is not the answer.

This would only work if there were delays on movement, and since people don't like delays this probably wouldn't work all together. Mines right now used right while hunting provide a delay.

[JettJackson]

http://www.cubitdesigns.com/yellow/spfdeth.html

an old sm fight that shows fleet killing, not to say it didnt change after but as it stands this is some evidence to say it wasn't at one point.

[liam290596]

As for this idea, I have many issues with it, some of which kard brought up. Furthermore it weakens landing fleet which would promote landing spread out. This in turn makes busting landers much less profitable. The problem is there is no in between, its either land all together and advantage to the lander busters as they'd kill the offliners first or spread out and advantage landers. Plus another issue is this basically takes any of the luck factor out of the game. Personally I like some luck involved, I mean if everything was straight forward people would just trade to 500k and destroy everyone after. The other issue is that slow or new players who may not fire as fast as elite vets would miss out on kills that would normally come in fleet fighting. The other day we had a newb get 3 kills in an ATM, you telling me with this change he would be able to do that? I would tell you that you are wrong. The fact is there are too many issues that are rising that would lead me to believe this is a bad idea.

being the newb in question ill be honest on that day i had no clue what was going on when i got those 3 kills i didnt even notice until people said you got kills and I was like win so to change it in a way where a guy like me who had no idea he was even firing to make it so that its down to skill it would have to be much simpler and easy to understand because otherwise those kills like jett said would never have existed and i would die simple as that

[JettJackson]

Another point that goes along with the luck factor is Liam was in an ATM, how is an ATM going to be able to get any kills with this change, they are too weak offensively to fight a wb straight up. Also anyone in a hunter that is at an op, say an HBC/DC would die very quickly if targeted where as a straight fleet to fleet allows for the damage distribution to be more even.

[Kard]

I mentioned to Page earlier too, that when we made our stand the other day, selection was so damn fast we could barely get examines on him. Thankgod dinky got a trigger. If combat was 1v1, that trigger wouldnt have killed him, and he probably couldve cleared the entire sector right from under 14 ships. that should not be possible. With fleet combat, if one person triggers him, he dies. 1v14 is death.

Ive heard some of the pros to 1v1 combat as well, and they are intriguing in theory, but will it play out so well in game. I dont think so. I think it should be tested in team semi wars first for a few games. Make alliances 5 members max, and all combat 1v1, and see if people like it. If they do, do a race wars with those becons you have to protect or whatever. If it passes the test again, try it in a real round.

Its a huge change and should not just go straight into game.

[JettJackson]

I mentioned to Page earlier too, that when we made our stand the other day, selection was so damn fast we could barely get examines on him. Thankgod dinky got a trigger. If combat was 1v1, that trigger wouldnt have killed him, and he probably couldve cleared the entire sector right from under 14 ships. that should not be possible. With fleet combat, if one person triggers him, he dies. 1v14 is death.

Ive heard some of the pros to 1v1 combat as well, and they are intriguing in theory, but will it play out so well in game. I dont think so. I think it should be tested in team semi wars first for a few games. Make alliances 5 members max, and all combat 1v1, and see if people like it. If they do, do a race wars with those becons you have to protect or whatever. If it passes the test again, try it in a real round.

Its a huge change and should not just go straight into game.

To me the cons far out weigh the pros on this one. There are just too many cons on both sides of the fence.

[seldum]

I really like this idea besides the drawbacks to fleet parking. If something could be done to promote planet use for more than just parking yet require ships to be landed there for these extra benefits to be realized then this idea is perfect.

As far as Kard's point about 14 v 1: You didnt have 14 you had like 6 and 8 empty ships with no pilots, how would a ship with no pilot know when to charge it's weapons and fire when the rest of the ships fire. The way it is now its pretty much like another player is using your account when you are off-line in a fleet and a teammate fires.

As far as liam and JJ's point about new or slower players: learn to get faster realistically how many people don't have high speed Internet, even if you don't have the fastest connection with the delay its a pretty level playing field as there is not much information transmitted to play SMR. This game should require some skill it took me like 10 years of eating pods before I learned enough to be a mediocre player. It took me 30 hours in beta games chasing the continue attack button around to learn to fire faster and now that is useless.